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Miami Dolphins Thread
Forum index >> Real football >> Miami Dolphins Thread Goto page : 1, 2, 3 ... 38, 39, 40 ... 103, 104, 105
 
Gatr22GI Supporter
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Posted on 2016-05-12 18:26:38
Emeraldfin wrote:

Gatr22 wrote:

Kagemusha wrote:

Gatr22 wrote:

Kagemusha wrote:

I love how Gatr blames Cutler for being out of Vandy, like if Vandy is a major disease for a QB.

Cutler is nothing more than average, has never been able to put it all together, i agree with that, but it doesnt have nothing to do with the college he played in.

Brees played college ball at Purdue and will be in the hall of fame.



Wow, Vandy fan, I guess. Nothing personal, but Vandy is in the SEC. I get to see Vandy play the Gators every season, because they reside in the SEC East. I'm very familiar with players that come out of the SEC and Vandy is normally the bottom rung on the SEC ladder, when it comes to football.



I couldnt care less about Vandy. I know they are the SEC's bottom feeders but I think it's funny you think him being from Vanderbilt is a precise indicator of his value as a player. Like it never happened that very good NFL players came from low level college programs.

He is still a better NFL QB than any guy out of Bama or Florida or LSU the last 15 years .



Grossman at least took the Bears to the Super Bowl. My reference to Vandy was also the fact that I had seen him play at the college level and already knew a lot about how he played at that level. Shoot, even Tebow got to the playoffs and beat Pittsburgh. Vandy is a bottom feeder, but the fact that I got to see him in college was the main reason for the reference



Playoff wins mean nothing unless you win the big one. Hell, Mark Sanchez has four playoff wins and I'd take Cutler everyday of the week over him.

The Bears can win with Cutler. They just won't win because of him. With a top 10 defense and solid run game, they would reach the playoff's if Cutler took care of the ball like he did last season.

The Broncos, Chiefs, Vikings, Bengals, Texans & Redskins all made the playoffs last season with anything but elite @ QB.



The Bears do have an elite running game and they do have a very good defense, always have for the most part. Cutler took care of the ball last year? 11 INT's, which really isn't bad. Amazing completion rate, but where are the yards? Terrible numbers! But if you watch the games, he consistently picks games to throw the ball anywhere the receivers are not. Then he has an awesome game and everyone is back on the Cutler train. I disagree with your assessment on some of those teams not having elite QB's. The Texans and Redskins, yes, the others, no. Too many QBs in the NFL getting a free pass year after year for just showing up and sparkling occasionally. Keeps everyone pumped for what could be, while the teams with elite QB's always seem to be hogging a QB on the bench that could be starting somewhere else. What is the Bear's answer? Let's sign Hoyer. Cutler will get banged up 4-6 games in and Hoyer will come in and win a game, then everyone will be on the Hoyer train until they realize he is just a transfer mop and loses the next 4 games. Cutler will come back and win a few, lose a few, while complaining about new or lingering injuries and they will start looking forward to the next season when, if Cutler can just stay healthy, that will be the year. Hoyer will be moved on and they will bring in the next scrub back up.

Just look at some of Cutler's lines in games: Take a 2014 game against the Lions, 1st half QB rating, 35!! 2nd half rating 87.5!! In the rematch that year, it was pretty much the reverse. A few weeks later against the Redskins, he hurt his groin in the 2nd quarter and left the game with an amazing 8.3 QB rating. Other games he comes in well over 90. I will say he is a tough guy and I don't doubt his injuries being some of the cause. I just don't see him ever being consistent enough to be the man. For me to get excited about his contract through 2020, no thanks
  
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LucaFGI Supporter
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Posted on 2016-05-12 20:12:53
Gatr22 wrote:



The Bears do have an elite running game and they do have a very good defense, always have for the most part. Cutler took care of the ball last year? 11 INT's, which really isn't bad. Amazing completion rate, but where are the yards? Terrible numbers! But if you watch the games, he consistently picks games to throw the ball anywhere the receivers are not. Then he has an awesome game and everyone is back on the Cutler train. I disagree with your assessment on some of those teams not having elite QB's. The Texans and Redskins, yes, the others, no. Too many QBs in the NFL getting a free pass year after year for just showing up and sparkling occasionally. Keeps everyone pumped for what could be, while the teams with elite QB's always seem to be hogging a QB on the bench that could be starting somewhere else. What is the Bear's answer? Let's sign Hoyer. Cutler will get banged up 4-6 games in and Hoyer will come in and win a game, then everyone will be on the Hoyer train until they realize he is just a transfer mop and loses the next 4 games. Cutler will come back and win a few, lose a few, while complaining about new or lingering injuries and they will start looking forward to the next season when, if Cutler can just stay healthy, that will be the year. Hoyer will be moved on and they will bring in the next scrub back up.

Just look at some of Cutler's lines in games: Take a 2014 game against the Lions, 1st half QB rating, 35!! 2nd half rating 87.5!! In the rematch that year, it was pretty much the reverse. A few weeks later against the Redskins, he hurt his groin in the 2nd quarter and left the game with an amazing 8.3 QB rating. Other games he comes in well over 90. I will say he is a tough guy and I don't doubt his injuries being some of the cause. I just don't see him ever being consistent enough to be the man. For me to get excited about his contract through 2020, no thanks



I don't think QB rating is an appropriate measure to assess such small sample sizes
I agree when you say that he is not the man and that his contract is really bad, but I have seen worse QBs go deep in the playoffs. There aren't enough Rodgers or Brady for every team, thus many teams are forced to pay big money to average QBs like Cutler. I don't think there was a better alternative in free agency at the time of his extension, and the front office didn't want to pull a move like the Eagles with Wentz.

I don't see how 2015 Bears D was "very good". It definitely improved from a dismal 2014, but I would not call them above average.

You really think Terry Bridgewater, 2015-Peyton and Alex "checkdown" Smith were elite? Peyton probably played as a bottom 5 QB and won the Superbowl! Even Cutler could have done it.

and as backup QB you can do worse than Hoyer. Just ask to Steelers, Cowboys and Ravens fans about their 2015 backups.
  
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Gatr22GI Supporter
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Posted on 2016-05-12 20:29:19
LucaF wrote:

Gatr22 wrote:



The Bears do have an elite running game and they do have a very good defense, always have for the most part. Cutler took care of the ball last year? 11 INT's, which really isn't bad. Amazing completion rate, but where are the yards? Terrible numbers! But if you watch the games, he consistently picks games to throw the ball anywhere the receivers are not. Then he has an awesome game and everyone is back on the Cutler train. I disagree with your assessment on some of those teams not having elite QB's. The Texans and Redskins, yes, the others, no. Too many QBs in the NFL getting a free pass year after year for just showing up and sparkling occasionally. Keeps everyone pumped for what could be, while the teams with elite QB's always seem to be hogging a QB on the bench that could be starting somewhere else. What is the Bear's answer? Let's sign Hoyer. Cutler will get banged up 4-6 games in and Hoyer will come in and win a game, then everyone will be on the Hoyer train until they realize he is just a transfer mop and loses the next 4 games. Cutler will come back and win a few, lose a few, while complaining about new or lingering injuries and they will start looking forward to the next season when, if Cutler can just stay healthy, that will be the year. Hoyer will be moved on and they will bring in the next scrub back up.

Just look at some of Cutler's lines in games: Take a 2014 game against the Lions, 1st half QB rating, 35!! 2nd half rating 87.5!! In the rematch that year, it was pretty much the reverse. A few weeks later against the Redskins, he hurt his groin in the 2nd quarter and left the game with an amazing 8.3 QB rating. Other games he comes in well over 90. I will say he is a tough guy and I don't doubt his injuries being some of the cause. I just don't see him ever being consistent enough to be the man. For me to get excited about his contract through 2020, no thanks



I don't think QB rating is an appropriate measure to assess such small sample sizes
I agree when you say that he is not the man and that his contract is really bad, but I have seen worse QBs go deep in the playoffs. There aren't enough Rodgers or Brady for every team, thus many teams are forced to pay big money to average QBs like Cutler. I don't think there was a better alternative in free agency at the time of his extension, and the front office didn't want to pull a move like the Eagles with Wentz.

I don't see how 2015 Bears D was "very good". It definitely improved from a dismal 2014, but I would not call them above average.

You really think Terry Bridgewater, 2015-Peyton and Alex "checkdown" Smith were elite? Peyton probably played as a bottom 5 QB and won the Superbowl! Even Cutler could have done it.

and as backup QB you can do worse than Hoyer. Just ask to Steelers, Cowboys and Ravens fans about their 2015 backups.



I would take Bridgewater or Smith over Cutler. I would not take a washed up Peyton over Cutler, but I would have taken their back up, Osweiler, last year. I certainly agree that there are a lot of crap QB's around the league and you're probably right, there just aren't enough great arms that can read the speed of NFL defenses and offenses. I'm more of a 'give em a few seasons and if it's not there, then change em out" kind of guy. Keep going until you find THE GUY. In the meantime, do your homework better on guys you're bringing in. If you look back in these very forums, there were plenty of threads regarding a certain Texas A & M QB by the name of Johnny Football. I don't even get paid to assess NFL talent and I could see that train wreck coming and said as much at the time. Some teams will continue to give him a shot, some folks will continue to cheerlead him. Well, I bet Cleveland wishes they had saved about 11 million on that dude.
  
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Hard-core fan (ultimate supporter owner)EmeraldfinGI Supporter
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Posted on 2016-05-12 21:57:13
LucaF wrote:

Gatr22 wrote:



The Bears do have an elite running game and they do have a very good defense, always have for the most part. Cutler took care of the ball last year? 11 INT's, which really isn't bad. Amazing completion rate, but where are the yards? Terrible numbers! But if you watch the games, he consistently picks games to throw the ball anywhere the receivers are not. Then he has an awesome game and everyone is back on the Cutler train. I disagree with your assessment on some of those teams not having elite QB's. The Texans and Redskins, yes, the others, no. Too many QBs in the NFL getting a free pass year after year for just showing up and sparkling occasionally. Keeps everyone pumped for what could be, while the teams with elite QB's always seem to be hogging a QB on the bench that could be starting somewhere else. What is the Bear's answer? Let's sign Hoyer. Cutler will get banged up 4-6 games in and Hoyer will come in and win a game, then everyone will be on the Hoyer train until they realize he is just a transfer mop and loses the next 4 games. Cutler will come back and win a few, lose a few, while complaining about new or lingering injuries and they will start looking forward to the next season when, if Cutler can just stay healthy, that will be the year. Hoyer will be moved on and they will bring in the next scrub back up.

Just look at some of Cutler's lines in games: Take a 2014 game against the Lions, 1st half QB rating, 35!! 2nd half rating 87.5!! In the rematch that year, it was pretty much the reverse. A few weeks later against the Redskins, he hurt his groin in the 2nd quarter and left the game with an amazing 8.3 QB rating. Other games he comes in well over 90. I will say he is a tough guy and I don't doubt his injuries being some of the cause. I just don't see him ever being consistent enough to be the man. For me to get excited about his contract through 2020, no thanks



I don't think QB rating is an appropriate measure to assess such small sample sizes
I agree when you say that he is not the man and that his contract is really bad, but I have seen worse QBs go deep in the playoffs. There aren't enough Rodgers or Brady for every team, thus many teams are forced to pay big money to average QBs like Cutler. I don't think there was a better alternative in free agency at the time of his extension, and the front office didn't want to pull a move like the Eagles with Wentz.

I don't see how 2015 Bears D was "very good". It definitely improved from a dismal 2014, but I would not call them above average.

You really think Terry Bridgewater, 2015-Peyton and Alex "checkdown" Smith were elite? Peyton probably played as a bottom 5 QB and won the Superbowl! Even Cutler could have done it.

and as backup QB you can do worse than Hoyer. Just ask to Steelers, Cowboys and Ravens fans about their 2015 backups.



Your right about the Bears defense from last year. They improved, but still struggled at times. Average for me. But I like what they have done in the off-season. Linebacker was a big problem last season and they have added two good ones in Trevathan and Freeman. They also drafted well, picking up Floyd and Bullard.

They also beefed up their OL and I like the addition of Zach Miller. With Kevin White hopefully back 100%, the Bears will push for the playoffs.

In a very tough division though.
  
Whammy Business
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Posted on 2016-05-12 22:07:15
Jay Cutler is firmly in the "too good to get rid of" category. The devil you know...
  
projectrracing
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Posted on 2016-05-12 23:27:01
Whammy Business wrote:

Jay Cutler is firmly in the "too good to get rid of" category. The devil you know...

And the devil you gave huge garanteed money to, and are all in financially. Much like the Eagles-Bradford stupidity. haha Oh those silly Eagles.
  
projectrracing
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Posted on 2016-05-12 23:31:24
Emeraldfin wrote:

The Broncos, Chiefs, Vikings, Bengals, Texans & Redskins all made the playoffs last season with anything but elite @ QB.

5 of 6 have Top 10 defenses.
5 of 6 have Top 15 QBs.
Miami/Chicago has neither a Top10 defense and/or Top15 QB.
I'm failing to see why you exampled these teams as a reference point to Miami/Chicago.
  
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Posted on 2016-05-12 23:47:37
projectrracing wrote:

Emeraldfin wrote:

The Broncos, Chiefs, Vikings, Bengals, Texans & Redskins all made the playoffs last season with anything but elite @ QB.

5 of 6 have Top 10 defenses.
5 of 6 have Top 15 QBs.
Miami/Chicago has neither a Top10 defense and/or Top15 QB.
I'm failing to see why you exampled these teams as a reference point to Miami/Chicago.



The reference was to show you don't need elite QB's to succeed. With a strong D and good running game, you won't need your QB to win you many games. Miami/Chicago's D's weren't good enough to compensate for their QB's shortcomings. But IMO, they can if they improve and the QB's aren't turning the ball over too much.

Out of curiosity, what are you basing/referencing those stats on?
  
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Posted on 2016-05-12 23:54:22
projectrracing wrote:

Emeraldfin wrote:

The Broncos, Chiefs, Vikings, Bengals, Texans & Redskins all made the playoffs last season with anything but elite @ QB.

5 of 6 have Top 10 defenses.
5 of 6 have Top 15 QBs.
Miami/Chicago has neither a Top10 defense and/or Top15 QB.
I'm failing to see why you exampled these teams as a reference point to Miami/Chicago.



Maybe to show how teams with no elite qbs go to playoffs.

By the way, I think only Cousins and Dalton were top 15 QBs in 2015 among those six.


  
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Posted on 2016-05-13 0:02:31
projectrracing wrote:

Emeraldfin wrote:

The Broncos, Chiefs, Vikings, Bengals, Texans & Redskins all made the playoffs last season with anything but elite @ QB.

5 of 6 have Top 10 defenses.
5 of 6 have Top 15 QBs.
Miami/Chicago has neither a Top10 defense and/or Top15 QB.
I'm failing to see why you exampled these teams as a reference point to Miami/Chicago.



I failed to see why either, but I have given up. A lifelong Bears fan and this is what we are just stuck with. Generally a good running game, generally a good defence and then spin the wheel of destiny for QB's and WR's. My whole point originally was just that the Bears and Miami have similar QB issues and they both apparently are content to cling to them. Each time they look brilliant, the supporters dig in and each time they look crappy, there is another excuse. There are a dozen more examples in the NFL, where one or two sparkles will get you 10 million. Maybe some of these guys are capable of being better, but unfortunately, somewhere along the way, they decided that they had ARRIVED. Once you think you have arrived, you're done in my opinion. You just turned in your edge for a bit of satisfaction and it's really hard to get that edge back. At the risk of pissing off some more fans, Romo will try, yet again, to get his edge back. If I were a betting man, I'd say it's time to turn those reins over too.
  
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Forum index >> Real football >> Miami Dolphins Thread Goto page : 1, 2, 3 ... 38, 39, 40 ... 103, 104, 105
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