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Physical skills by position
 
Hard-core fan (ultimate supporter owner)Radu27GI Supporter
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Posted on 2023-12-15 8:16:13
Hello all,
I have a question, if i may.
I know that with the rise of fall of BMI, Speed or Strength goes up and down, it's like that since ages, but i'm just curious, if you want a great DE or a great OLB, do you sacrifice the 20 strength for DE or the 20 speed for OLB?
In cases of these players (if they reach 20) the maximum speed or strength will be 15.
So would you play them like that? or would you take them down to 19 just so speed or strength could have at least 16?
What do you guys think?
  
SrednaDGI Supporter
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Posted on 2023-12-15 9:26:18
I might be wrong, but my experience is that DE's always attack the ball carrier - either RB's or the QB (if it is a passing play). Perhaps the INT test of the LB will decide if he should blitz , go into zone coverage or attack the HB.

OLB's will less often than the MLB push the passer.

Now, it is tricky as most teams run 90%. But form my LB's, they (only two as I sold one) have one sack in 4 seasons. Combined. (Just remember - poor team - poor stats).

So for an OLB, I would prefer speed over strength as I believe that the roll for an option for a tackle _should_ involve a test against speed, but as with almost everything in this game, I believe that only 2 or 3 factors are looked at when the dice are rolled. I like my LB's at 19/20 speed and 15/16 stength.

For DE's, I would prefer strength over speed. Strength (19 or 20), agility and tackling.

Do I train my LB's and DE's in footwork, vision, positioning, blocking (as the admin once wrote was used in the equation) and other skills, yes. Do the IMHO matter - No.

But this question also raises the question whether the engine is built for a 4-3 or 3-4 defense and whether it will be able to recognize the difference based on set formation. My belief is that the engine looks for a player in a set position to do something and if there is no such player (fx. DE if you are playing DT-NT-DT) then the engine will bypass any actions for that position and move on to the next. This is proven by the FS/SS process where SS are not used in coverage and FS are used in both. If you defend the pass without an FS, you will rarely have three options for a tackle (a CB and perhaps 2 LB's will attempt and fail a tackle leading to a TD).

  

"Quarterbacks should wear a dress." - Jack Lambert

If you are ever feeling down, just know that neither of Dorfenschmirtz's parents showed up to his birth.

Hard-core fan (ultimate supporter owner)Radu27GI Supporter
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Posted on 2023-12-15 9:50:50
Thank you for your inside.
But i asked something else.
If you have a OLB with 20 speed and 17 strength (and if you chose his 20 speed, his strength will be 15 because of BMI). Will you lower that players BMI, so that his strength will be 16, but his speed will be 19?
The same goes for the DEs, you have a player with 20 strength and 17 at speed. Would you lower his strength for his speed to rise with 1?
  
SrednaDGI Supporter
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Posted on 2023-12-15 11:05:23
Radu27 wrote:

Thank you for your inside.
But i asked something else.
If you have a OLB with 20 speed and 17 strength (and if you chose his 20 speed, his strength will be 15 because of BMI). Will you lower that players BMI, so that his strength will be 16, but his speed will be 19?
The same goes for the DEs, you have a player with 20 strength and 17 at speed. Would you lower his strength for his speed to rise with 1?



I would keep him at either level. Since we know so little about the effect of each skill / attribute it would be hard to detect any difference in a game.

IMHO, much more emphasis should be put into Consistency and BPOS.

A 15/15 capped LB with 5 star BPOS and 20 CON would be better for me than a 20/15 4½BPOS LB with sub 10 CON.
  

"Quarterbacks should wear a dress." - Jack Lambert

If you are ever feeling down, just know that neither of Dorfenschmirtz's parents showed up to his birth.

Hard-core fan (ultimate supporter owner)Radu27GI Supporter
Posts: 144
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Posted on 2023-12-15 12:25:15
SrednaD wrote:

Radu27 wrote:

Thank you for your inside.
But i asked something else.
If you have a OLB with 20 speed and 17 strength (and if you chose his 20 speed, his strength will be 15 because of BMI). Will you lower that players BMI, so that his strength will be 16, but his speed will be 19?
The same goes for the DEs, you have a player with 20 strength and 17 at speed. Would you lower his strength for his speed to rise with 1?



I would keep him at either level. Since we know so little about the effect of each skill / attribute it would be hard to detect any difference in a game.

IMHO, much more emphasis should be put into Consistency and BPOS.

A 15/15 capped LB with 5 star BPOS and 20 CON would be better for me than a 20/15 4½BPOS LB with sub 10 CON.



That should do the trick.
Thank you.
It not normal that talent beats physicals every time, but this is the way Grid-Iron is build. A simple game in which in 90% of the cases the better team always wins.
  
Gatr22GI Supporter
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Posted on 2023-12-15 23:01:42
Radu27 wrote:

SrednaD wrote:

Radu27 wrote:

Thank you for your inside.
But i asked something else.
If you have a OLB with 20 speed and 17 strength (and if you chose his 20 speed, his strength will be 15 because of BMI). Will you lower that players BMI, so that his strength will be 16, but his speed will be 19?
The same goes for the DEs, you have a player with 20 strength and 17 at speed. Would you lower his strength for his speed to rise with 1?



I would keep him at either level. Since we know so little about the effect of each skill / attribute it would be hard to detect any difference in a game.

IMHO, much more emphasis should be put into Consistency and BPOS.

A 15/15 capped LB with 5 star BPOS and 20 CON would be better for me than a 20/15 4½BPOS LB with sub 10 CON.



That should do the trick.
Thank you.
It not normal that talent beats physicals every time, but this is the way Grid-Iron is build. A simple game in which in 90% of the cases the better team always wins.



I would take the 20/15, 4.5* player, as he will perform better than the higher talent 50% of the time. Each roll over 10 up to 20 and he plays a percentage better than he would otherwise play. The 20 con higher talent always just performs as per his skills. I count speed and strength as important for that position of LB and I generally don't train LB position over 18 skill. I'm fine with either player, but I would give the slight nod to the 4.5 talent and 20 speed, as long as he has at least 10 con. Yes, he would perform less than his skills allow with rolls of 1 to 9, pre-game rating.
  

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Hard-core fan (ultimate supporter owner)Radu27GI Supporter
Posts: 144
Joined: 2022-09-16
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Hard-core fan (ultimate supporter owner)
Posted on 2023-12-15 23:15:25
Gatr22 wrote:

Radu27 wrote:

SrednaD wrote:

Radu27 wrote:

Thank you for your inside.
But i asked something else.
If you have a OLB with 20 speed and 17 strength (and if you chose his 20 speed, his strength will be 15 because of BMI). Will you lower that players BMI, so that his strength will be 16, but his speed will be 19?
The same goes for the DEs, you have a player with 20 strength and 17 at speed. Would you lower his strength for his speed to rise with 1?



I would keep him at either level. Since we know so little about the effect of each skill / attribute it would be hard to detect any difference in a game.

IMHO, much more emphasis should be put into Consistency and BPOS.

A 15/15 capped LB with 5 star BPOS and 20 CON would be better for me than a 20/15 4½BPOS LB with sub 10 CON.



That should do the trick.
Thank you.
It not normal that talent beats physicals every time, but this is the way Grid-Iron is build. A simple game in which in 90% of the cases the better team always wins.



I would take the 20/15, 4.5* player, as he will perform better than the higher talent 50% of the time. Each roll over 10 up to 20 and he plays a percentage better than he would otherwise play. The 20 con higher talent always just performs as per his skills. I count speed and strength as important for that position of LB and I generally don't train LB position over 18 skill. I'm fine with either player, but I would give the slight nod to the 4.5 talent and 20 speed, as long as he has at least 10 con. Yes, he would perform less than his skills allow with rolls of 1 to 9, pre-game rating.



That is another inside. Thank you.
I simply don't like the fact that i have to choose between them and fact of the matter here is that i consider 20 being a great OLB that could blitz a lot and get sacks. On the downside with that 15 strength i guess he will probably miss tackles against the rush.
Still,i have seen in NT players with 20/20 speed/strength and they had 19 on strength or speed and not 20.
  
 
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